Minute of meeting of 3 September 2025

Perth and Kinross Council · 4 February 2026
Back to Learning and Families Committee — 4 February 2026 and its agenda

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JOINT NEGOTIATING COMMITTEE FOR TEACHING STAFF
Minute of hybrid meeting of the Joint Negotiating Committee for Teaching Staff
(JNCT) held in Meeting Room 410, 2 High Street, Perth on Wednesday 3 September
2025 at 2.30pm.
Present: Representing Perth and Kinross Council
Councillors J Rebbeck and Councillor C Shiers; M Shaw,
E Moran, J McNicol (substituting for F MacKay), D Macluskey,
P Smith and N Thomson (all Education and Learning);
E Bayne (substituting for P Johnstone) (Strategic Planning,
People and Performance).
Representing Teachers’ Associations
J Cook, J Craigon, L Gibb, L J Grant, M Laurie, C Clarke
(substituting for J Leslie/M Taylor) and C Weston (all EIS);
M Mackie (SSTA); S Topen-Cooper (NASUWT)
In Attendance: A McConnachie for Joint Secretary (Management Side).
Apologies: Councillor S Carr, F MacKay, P Johnstone, J Leslie and
M Taylor.
Councillor J Rebbeck, Convener, Presiding.
1. Welcome and Apologies
Councillor J Rebbeck welcomed those present to the meeting and apologies
for absences were noted as above.
2. Declarations of Interest (Elected Members Only)
There were no Declarations of Interest made in terms of the Councillors’ Code
of Conduct. 
3. Minute of Meeting of the Joint Negotiating Committee for Teaching Staff
of 9 June 2025 for Approval
The Minute of meeting of the Joint Negotiating Committee for Teaching Staff
of 9 June 2025 was submitted and approved as a correct record.
4. Matters Arising
(i) Update on Wellbeing PR8 Post
D Macluskey acknowledged delays in fulfilling this post but following
conversations with HR they are hopeful someone will be matched in by
Monday next week.

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(ii) PT Management Time
M Shaw is the new Secondary Rep. They advised they only saw the
document last week and will need a bit of time to look at scale points,
minutes and the implications.
L J Grant and C Weston will meet with M Shaw separately to discuss.
(iii) New Education and Learning Landing Page on eric
D Macluskey shared this on screen.
The page has every policy, guidance and framework related to
Education and Learning and is actively curated.
It will be shown to Headteachers at their next forum and other feedback
will be gathered.
In response to a question on teaching staff needing time to complete
mandatory eLearning units on the Education and Learning Landing
Page D Macluskey explained separate to the landing page’s creation
there was a corporate decision to move online learning platforms and
in the first instance work is being done with corporate colleagues to
make sure that what was mandatory for teaching staff on the old
system lines up with the new system.
D Macluskey further advised in a wider Comms context they are trying
to minimise the number of emails that are sent out which was
welcomed by M Mackie. There was a suggestion from J Cook that this
could be helped by moving from the current system of multiple
platforms for communications to one. In response D Macluskey
advised we are a Microsoft organisation and probably what is needed
is clarity on what the different platforms do and what they should be
used for.
S Topen-Cooper queried if the problem with the servers at the start of
term had been resolved and voiced his frustrations around this. D
Macluskey advised the issue has been fixed but the cause has not
been identified. The full report will come to SLT, and he is happy to
bring that to a future JNCT meeting.
5. Membership Updates
The following Membership Updates were agreed:
 Martin Shaw and Eve Moran to replace John Donnelly and Gillian Knox
respectively on the Management Side.

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6. Business of Learning and Families Committee of 27 August 2025 for
Noting
Given the reports that went to the Learning and Families Committee on 27
August 2025 were also being brought to the JNCT today it was agreed to note them
as they were discussed.
7. Revised Central Team Structure Presentation
D Macluskey gave a brief PowerPoint presentation on recent changes to the
Education and Learning Management Team which included the recruitment of Eve
Moran and Neil Craik Collins as Quality Improvement Managers, the QIOs working
under them and an overview of their areas of responsibility.
Resolved:
The Committee noted the update.
8. PKC Education Improvement Plan 2025-26
There was submitted a report by the SAC and PEF Project Lead (G/25/213)
providing an update on progress against the Education Improvement Plan 2024-
2025, and detail on the priorities set within the new Education Improvement Plan
2025-2026.
M Laurie asked how “Stretch Aims” are set and whether the outcome of the
preceding year affects the aim for the next. D Macluskey explained Stretch Aims
were set using National and PKC data for a 3-year period. Given during this period
some aims have been overtaken Education Scotland have been asked if aims can
be recalculated but they have said “no”.
C Clarke asked about the recording of internal and alternatives to exclusions
and if they are not being recorded you could have a situation where the recorded
data shows exclusions are down, but it does not show that alternatives to exclusions
have increased in the same period.
S Topen-Cooper added that he thinks they should be recorded as there are
situations particularly in primary schools where there is no choice but to use
alternatives to exclusion as there are reasons a child cannot be sent home.
There was mention of some of the work being done as alternatives
to/diversions from exclusion such as Navigate and Connections.
M Shaw shared they have been using a method called “Restore, Reflect,
Reengage” sometimes as an alternative to exclusion with some success as a
number of pupils only needing to go through the process once and are not excluded
in the future.
D Macluskey agreed they should be recorded but decisions would need to be
made on how we do it and what system they are recorded on.
He also shared we already collect a lot of data already and his expectation
Head Teachers and Leadership Teams gather and interpret it as part of their role in
leading the school with support from the Management Team who will look at the
specifics.

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In response to C Weston asking if there is scope for using DASH to record the
data D Macluskey advised he thinks there is confusion about DASH in general,
there’s a conversation to be had about whether it could be and he will report back to
JNCT.
S Topen-Cooper suggested making it compulsory on Inservice Days to show
staff the different electronic platforms, but D Macluskey felt this could be
overcommunication and the need to find a balance.
In response to J Craigon’s suggestion of putting something on the new
landing page about the different electronic platforms D Macluskey said this could be
done but his expectation would be this would be included in introductions for new
starts/staff with headteachers leading on them and while as a council PKC do
headteacher inductions well that is not necessarily the case for other roles.
Resolved:
(i) D Macluskey to report back to Committee on using DASH to record
internal/alternative to exclusion data.
(ii) The Committee noted the contents of G/25/213.
9. Standards and Quality in Schools, Learning Communities and Pre-
School Centres/Day Care of Children
There was submitted a report by James Chiles, Performance & Improvement
Officer (G/25/219) setting out the key findings following inspections of schools and
nurseries by Education Scotland/His Majesty’s Inspectorate of Education (HMIE) and
of early learning and childcare (ELC) settings undertaken by the Care Inspectorate in
the day care of children since the previous Executive Sub-Committee of the Learning
and Families Committee on 2 June 2025.
C Weston asked if the schools identified as needing as more support are
getting it.
D Macluskey explained they are. There is a lot of focus from elected members
on the Learning and Families Committee on schools. The “self-evaluation” ratings
have been included in the report at the request of elected members as previously
they were not aware of problems until inspection.
He explained the Council’s aim is for every school to be awarded “good” or
“very good” in every category which he acknowledged is not necessarily achievable.
He went on to explain a risk-based approach is taken to support with universal
support provided to all schools and tailored/intensive support provided to schools
with “satisfactory” or below ratings or that have a specific issue not identified at
inspection.
J Cook asked how long the support lasts as the information in the report dates
back to 2016/17.
D Macluskey explained the support is based on a school’s current self-
evaluation ratings. That they report from 2016/17 because they always have done,

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and Councillors want to see that information as it shows the “journey” and fosters
discussions at their Committee.
Councillor Rebbeck added that not a lot of schools are inspected over a 5-
year period and by reporting the way they do it enables elected members to focus
resources where they are needed.
Councillor Shiers agreed adding that Councillors join at different times and
might otherwise not have all the information relating to a school.
D Macluskey advised he is held accountable by elected members.
Resolved:
The Committee noted the contents of 25/219.
10. Accessibility Strategy and Action Plan 2025-2028
There was submitted a report by Jennifer McNicol, Quality Improvement
Officer and Fiona MacKay, Service Manager, Inclusion and Additional Support
(G/25/215) that went to Committee on 27 August 2025 requesting approval of the
Accessibility Strategy and Action Plan 2025-2028, which delivers on a duty of the
education authority in relation to the Education (Disability Strategies and Pupils’
Educational Records) (Scotland) Act 2002.
With reference to the “How Do We Measure Success?” section C Weston asked if
feedback could be given to the Committee to which J McNicol advised it could.
Resolved:
The Committee noted the contents of G/25/215.
11. Scottish Attainment Challenge Funding Report
There was submitted a draft report (G/25/122) that is required to be
submitted to Scottish Government summarising the interventions implemented
during the course of the year along with evidence of their impact and any qualitative
and quantitative data relating to the impact of SEF, CECYPF and PEF funding.
In response to C Weston asking if the “Cost of the School Day Policy” is still in
draft D Macluskey advised it is and has been included for early sight with a further
detailed discussion to take place at a future JNCT.
In response to J Cook suggesting that the words do not necessarily match the
graphics in terms of the poverty related gap decreasing D Macluskey said they may
have overegged the wording as some aspects of the gap are closing while some are
not.
J Cook asked with poverty in general increasing if there is more scope to
working with families.
E Moran advised there is recognition of that, and multiagency work is
underway in the early piloting stages.

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D Macluskey added the Council has a corporate priority to reduce poverty
with Councillor Rebbeck adding it is something everyone needs to support and that
all on the Learning and Families Committee are on the same page to that regard.
Resolved:
The Committee noted the contents of G/25/122.
12. Intensive Support Provision
J McNicol gave a verbal update stating all 3 ISPs within Phase 1 - the
Secondary provisions at Perth and Kinross High and the Primary provision at
Viewlands – have all opened and will be signed off permanently at the end of
October.
Statutory Consultation on Phase 2 – All-Through provisions at Auchterarder
and St John’s – has started.
L J Grant asked about the role of teachers, specifically as they would be
supervising young people with a high level of need when it came to non-class
contact time or if an ISP teacher was absent if a non-ISP teacher be expected to
take the class.
J McNicol advised the ISP model is that non-class contact time is met through
a subject specialist class teacher and ISP support staff. Where an ISP teacher is
absent and the ISP PT or the DHT Support could not cover the class, and only when
this had been exhausted, the natural ask would be a subject specialist teacher who
knows the class well.
Councillor Rebbeck added he is keenly aware of the importance of ISP and
while it should not be detrimental to mainstream schooling it also should not be
completely separate.
Resolved:
The Committee noted the update.
13. Smarter Working
E Bayne gave a verbal update. Following the Council’s purchase of Pullar
House, to facilitate the renting out of space within it there are office moves taking
place within both Pullar House and 2 High Street, some of which have already
happened, and to make Committee members aware that their Education and
Learning colleagues may have moved.
Resolved:
The Committee noted the update.
14. Disclosure Scotland
E Bayne gave a verbal update. New legislation came into effect in April 2025
and the 3-month window for compliance ended on 30 June 2025. There is some
clarification outstanding around other staff within schools that legal colleagues are
looking into. Work is also being done to ensure for any colleagues that are off theirs

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is in place for their return. There is also no longer lifelong membership to the scheme
instead membership will last for 5 years and then it will need renewed.
Resolved:
The Committee noted the update.
15. Any Other Competent Business
(i) C Weston proposed setting up a Working Time Agreement Audit which
was accepted.
(ii) S Topen-Cooper asked if following the Supreme Court Ruling if the
Council have put out anything to schools.
D Macluskey advised the Scottish Government are waiting on guidance
from the Equalities Commission but in the meantime the law has
changed. Property are working with schools to make sure there are
single sex spaces, and they are used appropriately.
It was thought Perth High would have been compliant, but it was
explained M Shaw took further steps to ensure it was.
S Topen-Cooper expressed his personal opinion that he thinks Local
Authorities are jumping the gun by taking decisions before there is
guidance from the Scottish Government.
(iii) D Macluskey shared the Employee Survey opens in November with a
plea staff are encouraged to complete it.
16. Date of Next Meeting
19 November 2025