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Minute of meeting of 9 December 2024

Perth and Kinross Council · 30 April 2025
Back to Finance and Resources Committee — 30 April 2025 and its agenda

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PERTH AND KINROSS COUNCIL
FINANCE AND RESOURCES COMMITTEE
EMPLOYEES JOINT CONSULTATIVE COMMITTEE
Minute of hybrid meeting of the Employees Joint Consultative Committee held in the
Room 410, 2 High Street, Perth on Monday 9 December 2024 at 2.00pm.
Present: Representing Perth and Kinross Council:
Councillors K Allan, S McCole and J Rebbeck (Item 8 onwards).
Present: Representing Trade Unions:
N Ferry (UNISON)
S Hope (UNISON)
S Topen-Cooper (NASUWT)
C Weston (EIS) (up to and including Item 8)
In Attendance:  J Guild, L Hamilton, P Johnstone, C Judge, F MacKay, L McGeorge
and F Thomson.
Apologies: V Leonard, M Mackie and S Robertson.
S Hope in the Chair.
1. Welcome and Apologies
S Hope welcomed all present to the meeting and apologies were noted as
above.
2. Declarations of Interest
There were no declarations of interest made in terms of the Councillors’ Code
of Conduct.
3. Minute of Meeting of The Employees Joint Consultative Committee of
16 September 2024 For Approval
The minute of meeting of the Employees Joint Consultative Committee of
16 September 2024 was submitted and approved as a correct record.
4. Matters Arising
(i) H&S Consultative Committees
L Hamilton advised there has been a slight delay in establishment of the
Committees and the framework will be in place by March 2025 with the first
meeting to be arranged thereafter.
(ii) Employee Survey Action Points
F Thomson advised that organisation wide themes have been identified while
actions continue to be taken forward by individual managers.  Some actions

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are already in place i.e. Health and Wellbeing so promotion will be increased
and with relevant progressions made as required.
(iii) Fair Work First
F Thomson advised that Scottish Government guidance recently received now
makes specific reference to equality requirements and a meeting to progress
any related actions will be held with the Trade Unions in the new year.
5. Health nd Safety Performance Report Quarter 2 – July-September
2024/25
There was a report submitted by the Corporate Health and Safety Team
Leader (G/24/199) informing and assisting the Employees Joint Consultative
Committee in monitoring health and safety compliance and performance
across Perth and Kinross Council and providing an overview of health and
safety activities undertaken.
In response to a question from S Topen-Cooper regarding resolution of staff
absences of longer than 7 days following incidents at work, L Hamilton
confirmed 3 of 5 have returned to work but she could not comment on
individual supports in place.
Resolved:
The contents of Report G/24/199, be noted.
6. FIRE SAFETY QUARTERLY REPORT – QUARTER 2 – JULY-SEPTEMBER
2024/25
There was a report submitted by the Strategic Lead – Strategic Planning,
People and Performance (G/24/200) informing and assisting the Employees
Joint Consultative Committee in monitoring fire safety performance across
Perth and Kinross Council and providing an overview of fire safety activities
undertaken.
In response to a question from Councillor McCole regarding the use of a
nebuliser setting off a fire alarm at Fairview School, L Hamilton advised she
would provide more information in due course and further advised the
establishment will be reprioritised for fire risk assessment.
Resolved:
The contents of Report G/24/200, be noted.
7. Staff Reporting: Incidents of Violence/Aggression and Incidents of
Distressed/Challenging Behaviour In Education Settings, Term 1 2024/25
There was a report submitted by the Strategic Lead – Education and Learning
(G/24/201) informing Employees Joint Consultative Committee of the
Education Service’s performance in managing and reducing incidents of
violence and aggression or distressed and challenging behaviour that have
impacted staff in the workplace. The report provides a summary of the

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information gathered in Term 1 of academic year 2024/2025 in relation to staff
reports of incidents in schools and other educational settings which had an
emotional or physical impact on them. It also provides information on the
activity of an established working group to prevent and reduce the number of
incidents.
In response to a question from C Weston in relation to the process for
reporting and how many reports are returned within the timescale, F MacKay
advised she will explore and feedback in due course.  F MacKay added it is
the responsibility of the headteacher to acknowledge the report has been
received and provide initial supports during the debrief with the involved staff
member.  F MacKay further advised there is to be CALM training for
headteachers and managers to support consistency in relation to debriefing.
In response to another question from C Weston regarding additional supports
for Teachers in the first terms of Primary 1 in response to the reported figures,
F MacKay advised that additional staff and funding has been committed,
however, feedback from Headteachers often reflects Term 1 as a settling in
period which is likely to be reflected in Term 2 data.
In response to a third question from C Weston regarding clear expectations
and consequences for acceptable and non-acceptable behaviour, F MacKay
advised that further advice would be sought from S Turner, Inclusion Service
Manager.
In response to a question from S Topen-Cooper in relation to the online
videos regarding acceptable behaviours and consequences but lack of
specific definitions for staff and uncertainty this is causing, F MacKay advised
that it is challenging to give a clear definition which will fit every situation,
however, Headteachers should be aware of parameters and Codes of
Conduct from GTCS.
P Johnstone added that PKC have clear guidelines in relation to de-escalation
and laying on hands (Physical Intervention Policy).  P Johnstone added this
will be reinforced to raise awareness but is also due to be reviewed in line with
new national guidance.
In response to another question from S Topen-Cooper regarding staff
reporting no difference in the short term due to the length of reporting
processes and whether access to the reporting system could be more readily
available on staff computers, F MacKay agreed this could be looked into.
In response to a question from S Hope regarding transitional planning
between nursery and Primary 1, F MacKay advised information and
arrangements to develop relationships between pupils and staff in advance is
being developed for all Council run and private nurseries.  F MacKay added
that transitions between year groups at all levels are also being enhanced.
In response to a question from Councillor McCole regarding a correlation
between incidents of violence and aggression or distressed and challenging
behaviour and whether children have been in a nursery setting prior to starting

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school, F MacKay advised that the majority of children have been through an
early learning setting but acknowledged that it can cause issues with planning
if they haven’t.  F MacKay added that earlier intervention with early learning
settings is part of ongoing work in relation to the ASN transformation.
P Johnstone added that the Poverty Action Group is also looking at any
correlation with families and young people who may have additional support
needs.
Resolved:
The contents of Report G/24/201, be noted.
(Councillor J Rebbeck joined the meeting at this point.)
8. Unison Violence and Aggression Survey
There was a slide-based presentation delivered by N Ferry, UNISON, sharing
the initial results of a recent staff survey.
Full results will be shared with the Committee by email with further updates
comparing results to the 10 point charter, brought to the next meeting.
Resolved:
The contents of the presentation, be noted.
(C Weston left the meeting at this point.)
9. Modern Apprentice Programme Update
There was a report submitted by the People and Culture Manager (G/24/202)
providing an update to the Employee Joint Consultative Committee, on the
achievements of the Councils’ Modern Apprentice Programme over the past
year.
L McGeorge commented on the successful experience of engaging a Modern
Apprentice in her team, and hope to be able to offer them a permanent
position in future.
Resolved:
The contents of Report G/24/202, be noted.
10. Health and Wellbeing Update
There was a report submitted by the People and Culture Manager (G/24/298)
providing an update on current Health and Wellbeing data and current Health
and Wellbeing activities.
Resolved:
The contents of Report G/24/198, be noted.

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11. Equalities Update
There was a report submitted by the People and Culture Manager (G/24/203)
providing an update on recent and planned employment equality activities
within Perth & Kinross Council, reinforcing our commitment to an inclusive
workplace. Additional information from the Housing and Communities
Equalities Team Leader was also shared.
S Hope added his thanks to C Judge, People and Culture Team Leader, and
D McPhee, Equalities Team Leader, for their ongoing work. 
Resolved:
The contents of Report G/24/203, be noted.
12. Worker Protection Act (Amendment Of Equality Act 2010) 2024
P Johnstone advised the Employees Joint Consultative Committee of a new
duty which came into force on 26 October 2024 to prevent sexual harassment
in the course of employment.  Work is ongoing with Unions and others to
capture data, develop an appropriate reporting mechanism and raise
awareness.
Resolved:
The Committee noted the position.
13. Vacancy and Post Management Measures
F Thomson advised additional scrutiny processes for all vacancies are
ongoing with a view to managing budget resources.  Alternative ways to fill
vacancies or delay in filling vacancies, if appropriate, are being considered. 
Any exceptions continue to be processed as quickly as possible.
Resolved:
The Committee noted the position.
14. Workforce Planning Themed Board (Employer Branding)
F Thomson stated that the People and Culture Strategy 2024-2028 approved
by Committee in June 2024 now included recommendations in the action plan
following a recent audit by Audit Scotland. The Workforce Planning Themed
Board established to bring a coordinated approach across the organisation
and share good practice is overseeing the actions and progress arising from
the audit and strategy.  Workforce plans are currently being worked on by
Strategic Leads.
She explained that one working group reporting to the Board is the Employer
of Choice group looking at the Council employer brand and promotion of
opportunities. A request was made for a union representative to join the
group.

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Resolved:
(i) The Committee noted the position.
(ii) It be agreed that N Ferry be appointed to the Board as the Union
Representative.
15. Date of Next Meeting
Wednesday 26 March 2025 at 1.30pm.